Singing Forum by Ken Tamplin Vocal Academy
Hey Dudes and Divas!

Welcome to Singer Forum by Ken Tamplin Vocal Academy. Enrolled KTVA vocalists have access to the full singer forums, self-registered members have access to limited areas of the KTVA singing forum. Register to learn more.

To enroll in Ken Tamplin Vocal Academy Singing Lessons click here.

Confidence in singing and taking criticism in stride

matt53matt53 Posts: 182Pro
edited July 2014 in Psychology of Singing
I will never understand why singing seems to be the most harshly judged type of musical performance. I find that many people, including my bandmates, friends and family, will consider a musician with average playing ability as very good or even "talented," yet reserve harsh judgment for singers I would consider very good, over minor things.
Are most people just jealous of singers because singers have the confidence to sing and express their feelings?
Case in point: my friends have a mutual friend who sings alot and is regarded by girls and other people as a very good singer. My friends constantly criticize him, and I asked them why. Upon pressing further, I found that that they think he is actually very good at singing.
I realize that they are probably just jealous of his abilities and confidence and therefore look for any kind of fault to tear him down.
As a tenor choral singer at my church, I have received several compliments on my singing voice. A while ago, one lady even said I have a "beautiful voice," though I personally think I have quite a ways to go in terms of my potential technical growth as a singer. Another person (whom I am not on good terms with at all) came up to my parents and said he loves listening to me sing and that he really likes my voice.
After years of working on my singing voice, without alot of encouragement from people I know, these compliments were a much-needed confidence-boost.
When I told this story to my "best friend," something very strange happened. Instead of being happy for me, I noticed a scared look on his face and he started saying the people giving the compliments probably didn't know anything about singing.
I was a bit surprised by this, but I began to wonder if he was jealous.
Nowadays I get more compliments than criticism about my singing, but it seems that the criticism I do get comes from a place of jealousy rather than a place of constructive comments or advice.
To any singer on this forum getting insulted or criticized about singing, please realize that it will just make you tougher and that you eventually will get the recognition and compliments you deserve for your hard work and perfecting your technique.

Comments

  • 23 Comments sorted by Votes Date Added
  • There's a lot of different perspectives to this question.  Ultimately I think when someone says they don't like your voice it feels like being rejected, or similar to if someone said they don't find you attractive.  How can it not feel personal, your voice is an extension of yourself.

    I like the sound of Geddy Lee's voice.  I enjoy how it fits with RUSH's music.  However, I've heard a lot of people say they don't like his voice complaining it is thin and nasally.  I don't think they are trying to be mean, but just that's how the sound of his voice affects them.

    There are a lot of pro singers that I don't enjoy listening to as well.  We all have different opinions with art and aesthetics.

    The worst experience I've faced was working with a very good drummer who just didn't like me as a lead vocalist.  He stubbornly held a belief that good singers were just born that way, and most people could not train themselves to be good singers.  Every other band I'd play with was complimentary towards my vocals and it made me feel good, but this guy really shook my confidence to where I started taking lessons and continued a search towards improving my voice (leading me eventually to Ken's program).

    I think the main take away we all need to accept is that not everyone is going to like our voice, and that's ok.  Just do the things you need to do to make yourself happy with your singing, play with people who you enjoy playing with and just love what you are doing.
  • highmtnhighmtn Posts: 10,664Administrator, Moderator, Enrolled, Pro

    Yes, it's true.  Many compliments come from total strangers.  They have nothing to lose by sharing with you that you made them feel good or that they were impressed.  In fact, they feel compelled to tell you how much they enjoy your singing.

    Your friends may feel threatened that you will gravitate away from their friendship to these people that you don't really know. 

    That's kind of silly, but singing is a very personal thing.  When someone says they don't care for your singing, sometimes it can SEEM as if they are saying they don't care about or like YOU.  And they may be very reserved about ever letting you or others know that they really think you are a "good" singer.

    As singers, we have to have a bit thicker skin, so that when a stick in the mud shares their gloom with us, that we don't fall into the trap of being crushed.

    It is really very nice when a person you've never met before goes out of their way to tell you how much they enjoy listening to your voice.  The people that are made uncomfortable about that must feel insecure because no strangers are approaching them to tell them how much they are appreciated.  What kind of a response is "They must not know anything about singing"???  What???

    Yes, there is jealousy and insecurity involved here.  And it is our job to be gracious to both the person giving compliments, and also to the person feeling insecure about us being successful with our pursuit of our vocal goals. 

    Ya gotta love 'em!


    Bob


  • Singing takes an enormous amount of courage. There is no word available in the English language to accurately describe the courage needed to sing publicly and open yourself up to broad review and criticism. I am in awe of the guys in this forum who just lay it out on the line. Brilliant. At least on this forum you have colleagues who will give you positive advice and help, and not shoot you down.

    As for the others, well .... these are the guys we are eventually trying to prove wrong by rockin their jocks off. This should be the fire in your belly that drives you to get better each day, each week, each month, each year and each decade.

    Remember, as we are 'students for life', we are always going to have weaknesses in our voice, just as about every other singer on the planet, whether amateur or professional. Great singers are often great in a narrow range/aspect/style. It is important to take the criticism as an indication of where our weaknesses are, and then aim to strengthen that weakness.

    I sound terrible during practice. Why? Because i'm working on my weaknesses. I don't need to practice my strengths, they're safely in the bag of tricks. I'm stretching my boundaries during practice. There is a great quote I recently read from a famous violin teacher, she said (i'll paraphrase) "if someone walking by your house can distinguish the song you are practising, then you are practising wrong". Practicing your strengths over and over again is a waste of time, you don't improve as fast as you would if you are stretching just beyond your capabilities.

     

  • I didn't realize when I was younger the people who discouraged me from becoming a singer was actually jealous of me. Lots of strangers told me that I have a good voice and I could become the next America Idol, but then again I had these so called friends of mine always putting me down. after a few years of not singing and practicing I am finally back and ready to achieve my dream as a professional singer. Thanks to those strangers I am in a choir to achieve my goals to reach my dream. I am glad I found KTVA. All I can say is, don't let anyone stop you from doing what you enjoy the most, strive for the best and believe in yourself.
  • matt53matt53 Posts: 182Pro
    edited July 2014 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Yeah I can understand it because I used to get jealous myself whenever I heard this family acquaintance sing. Her voice was very loud and strong and she had a good tone, but I guess she was so good it was annoying, if that makes any sense.
    At any rate, I wish there was some way I could thank Ken personally for the way my voice has grown. I am going back through all the volumes and I feel I have come a long way in terms of getting a handle on the KTVA technique. I am now able to somewhat decently cover songs with my bands that are way up in the tenor range like Helter Skelter, Led Zeppelin songs, Carry on My Wayward Son.
    It will be exciting to see where my voice will be in a couple years if I keep practicing, working on my technique and applying Ken's wisdom.
  • matt53matt53 Posts: 182Pro
    edited July 2014 Vote Up0Vote Down
    And you're totally right about developing a thicker skin. 
    When someone like my pesky little brother tells me I suck when I'm practicing a difficult song for the first time, it doesn't hurt me because his comment is unnecessary.
    When you're singing through that mic and you can hear what you're actually sounding like, you KNOW more than anyone in the band or audience if you're doing great or you suck on that particular song.
    It's kinda funny because in learning how to play piano and guitars, I made THOUSANDS of mistakes without getting ridiculed. 
    In fact, I just got more encouragement.
    However, when I first started singing and made loud, EMBARRASSING mistakes, it was as if I had suddenly incurred the wrath of the gods. COUNTLESS times my family members and even my neighbors would tell me to stop or shut up.
    These insults used to hurt my feelings to a big degree, but I always resolved to just work harder and smarter.
    Today, the only complaint I get from my family when practicing is that my mic is too loud or my choice of songs isn't to their liking. When I am on pitch, my tone is good, and I hit all the high notes, I find it amusing when someone tries some tiny thing to criticize me lol
    Like you said, Bob, our confidence needs to stem from ourselves, as cliched as that might sound. I find that no one you know is really going to cheer you on, so celebrate your singing triumphs and learn from your mistakes.
    We can't seek out or depend on the approval of others. Us singers really have to be our own biggest cheerleaders.
  • Hello,

    About the harsch criticism regarding singers, one of my friend one day pointed out that singing does not suffer too much imperfection. While we are more tolerant with musicians, we are not the same with singers. My idea is that the singer is a messenger, her/his task is very important... just a thought to ponder...

  • matt53matt53 Posts: 182Pro
    edited September 2014 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Hey Hodgepodge, your drummer sounds just like my "best friend," a guitarist in my band. Just a thought, but can he actually sing himself? lol 

    My experience has been that when people criticize you in a way that shows they want to help you, they say something constructive like I think you sound great but have a few little kinks to work out such as being a bit flat sometimes. When people are just like, "You can't sing" when your tone is great, pitch is great and you're hitting insane notes with awesome control, it's painfully obvious that they're jealous. Don't get discouraged. When I was starting out singing, I could just feel everyone cringe because I was awful. And practice is the only way you can get better. Today, I receive more and more compliments than ever. Don't worry. Recognition always comes a lot later than you feel you deserve it lol

    As for, "good singers are born not made," that is a load of crap. Eddie Vedder is an acclaimed "natural" who nonetheless shouts and quite often, shouts flat to get his high notes. Some people on other singing forums hate on Ken for having an "undesirable" contrived voice, but he has received offers from Journey(!), Deep Purple and Foreigner, if I am correct. Just work on your technique and putting soul into your singing, and you will be surprised at how many people will eventually give you compliments. Just to give you some inspiration, today I was practicing songs in my band's setlist and one of my brother's gaming buddies said I was "really good" and "enjoyed my performance," even though I was a bit flat in some points and not really warmed up. Keep singing and putting in that practice, Hodgepodge!
  • @ Joseth, great advice, !

    Hello,

    I wish to share my recent experience about being harshly criticised.

    We 
    had our show on the 13th of June, we were at least 15 singers male and female each performing 2 songs in front of a small town audience, family, friends.
    I sang my song with joy, ease, and I had tremendeous fun! May be the first time since I started to sing.


    At the end of the show, total strangers came to see me to tell me how TERRIFIC my performance had been, that my energy was contagious... etc that they were thrilled etc, 

    .

    Two days later, my singing teacher told me that I should not forget that I am only an amateur, and that my performance was "too much of this, not enough of that" and that I did not look "natural" while singing plus other harsh remarks about my outfit. I was devastated! He also added that I should not listen to what the audience say since they don't know anything about singing...


    I have lost my enthusiasm and my confidence as a result but not for long hopefully as I just realised how toxic this guy is. Criticism should always be constructive and helpful not  subversive. Next time I will know better...

    Cheers...
  • streeterstreeter Posts: 656Moderator, Pro
    edited June 2015 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Joyce said:
    @ Joseth, great advice, !

    Hello,

    I wish to share my recent experience about being harshly criticised.

    We 
    had our show on the 13th of June, we were at least 15 singers male and female each performing 2 songs in front of a small town audience, family, friends.
    I sang my song with joy, ease, and I had tremendeous fun! May be the first time since I started to sing.


    At the end of the show, total strangers came to see me to tell me how TERRIFIC my performance had been, that my energy was contagious... etc that they were thrilled etc, 

    .

    Two days later, my singing teacher told me that I should not forget that I am only an amateur, and that my performance was "too much of this, not enough of that" and that I did not look "natural" while singing plus other harsh remarks about my outfit. I was devastated! He also added that I should not listen to what the audience say since they don't know anything about singing...


    I have lost my enthusiasm and my confidence as a result but not for long hopefully as I just realised how toxic this guy is. Criticism should always be constructive and helpful not  subversive. Next time I will know better...

    Cheers...

    @Joyce That is just ridiculous. Get rid of your singing teacher. 80 percent of singing is confidence. Maybe he was having a bad day. Maybe he is not is a performer, maybe he is one of those teachers that seems to be oh so common in the vocal industry... Those who can't do, teach... Then he makes you feel bad by acting superior because of his own inferiority. Teachers should be correcting in their lessons but they should never be belittling an audiences opinion or berating a student over a performance. This is just awful. Sorry to hear about your experience. I hope you get over it. Remember singing is as much about your joy as it is to entertain others. The audience isn't full of cynical vocal instructors taking notes, it's full of people who want to be entertained and have a good time. F**%# that guy. Anyone who goes to an event purely to berate it, is clearly dealing with their own inadequacy. Unfortunately the Internet has also given these people a massive soapbox on which to stand. Some of the comments I've seen on YouTube regarding singers such as Arnel Pineda, Kelly Hanson or whomever else has happened to step into some big shoes are just poisoness.
  • highmtnhighmtn Posts: 10,664Administrator, Moderator, Enrolled, Pro
    edited June 2015 Vote Up0Vote Down

     @Joyce

    Thank you for sharing your story.  What a terrible thing that was for your singing teacher to say to you!  

    So your teacher thinks that the audience is a bunch of ignorant fools and only his opinion counts.  And he evidently didn't think there was anything at all wrong with devastating your feelings in order to boost his own self-importance. 

    Do you really need to subject yourself to this clown's opinion anymore?  Maybe you do, if you're in a small town and his is the only show around...  But his remarks are really inexcusable, and it would be better to form a new singing group that doesn't include the Grinch as the master of ceremonies and Judge of all that is good and worthy.  

    He should be nurturing his students, not belittling them. That is morally wrong.  He does not belong in a position of authority over singing students. 

    Find your joy from within, in your heart that wants to sing.  Find it in the joy of those complete strangers whose hearts you touched with your voice.  A vocal coach's job is to encourage, to shine a light on what is right, and to help students to have the courage to get up there in front of people and do it again and again, not make them want to quit.  

    You can always come here to share your stories and to find confidence in your voice.  We are proud of you for your performance and for the way you gave your energy and joy up to the audience and for how they gave that back to you.  

    Unfortunately your singing teacher has no idea what singing is REALLY ALL ABOUT.  It's in the giving and the receiving... not the discouraging and belittling.  

    WHAT A JERK.

    Don't let him take away your spirit of joy and love of singing!

    Rock on, Joyce!


    Bob


  • blondiewalesblondiewales Posts: 174Pro
    edited September 2015 Vote Up0Vote Down
    @Joyce

    Whoa. What kind of singing instructor says that? I don't even know where to start. You should take solace that the audience loved your performance, and that was all that mattered. Did he even hear you perform? Truly, live performance is about sharing your good time with your audience. Vocal technique that imbues us with things like tone, pitch, timing, clarity, and range is to ensure that we can continue performing for people for many years to come. Even if I did not like someone's vocal style, I would not openly berate their performances unless they specifically asked, even if they were pro. Personally, I hate the vocal tone of a lot of country singers. They honestly have very limited range and power. However, I would never outright say that to them. Who am I to discourage them from doing what they love?

    Truly, a lot of criticism probably does stem from jealousy. My question is, do these people know that they are lying to themselves or have they actually subconsciously convinced themselves that what they're hearing is bad?
  • highmtnhighmtn Posts: 10,664Administrator, Moderator, Enrolled, Pro
    Joyce, you had a very insightful comment in this very thread about a year ago when you mentioned that some listeners are very forgiving of mistakes or differences of choice in style with musicians and other artists, but because singing is so PERSONAL, sometimes very brutal and hurtful comments are made, as if that's OK.  Since your JUST a singer, and you're JUST my friend or relative, (not a star) I can crush you with a few well-placed put-downs.  Isn't that WEIRD that people do that to you?  Is it because they know they can slip a knife through a chink in your armor?  So they do it just because they CAN, and they know it's hurtful??? 

    Friends and relatives may be very withholding of compliments on vocal performances for the oddest of reasons.  

    It's like they don't want you to get the BIG-HEAD from hearing a compliment.  Heaven forbid that you might begin to think that you don't sound terrible every time you open your mouth and sing.  

    It's just kind of strange how reserved some folks can be and how they can be very careful to NOT compliment you, lest ye begin to believe in yourself that yes, there IS Hope that you can sing and sing well... 

    Sing for yourself and for those who want to hear your soul.  Try to avoid those who wish to step on your soul and squash it.  Find other friends and listeners. 

    EVERYONE in this thread, going back almost a year has had some insightful things to say about what's happening down under in the minds of the jealous competitors when we give a good delivery of a song straight from the heart.  That's right where the jealous ones want to stab us.  

    Isn't that Weird?  What's Up With THAT????

    Bob
  • JoyceJoyce Posts: 128Pro
    edited June 2015 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Thank you so much for your support and understanding, it is so refreshing!!!!!! And I needed this.

    @Streeter : yes, I should get rid of this teacher but he also happens to be a show organiser plus there are other singers in his group that I LOVE to sing with. Sometimes I feel that I should start my own group but it requires a lot of time which I am short of right now and also I lack experience in this activity.

    @Highmtn, you are so right!!! he is a clown but, there is not enough competition in the small town where I live. And that's exactly what happened I sang with my heart, and I gave the audience what I had always dreamed of: my joyful mood and energy. The song was not high pitched or complicated, but I managed to honor it and I am proud of myself.Yes I think he wants me to quit, but I WON'T....

    @Blondiewales: what you say is very intesting as it show how some singing coaches can totally confuse us instead of helping. I think we can recognise very quicky what is helpful and what is not, yes singing is personal, our personality is put in the song and sometimes too much technique can take away our spontaneity.

    I am not going to quit singing, God no and my next song will be a Brazilian song, and I can guarantee that I will be swinging like mad...

    Thanks again for your help and support, so very much appreciated...
  • @blondiewales, I have a similar experience with my friends who are singers as well. I sing in a choir, and there used to be a family friend of ours who sang tenor with me. When I first started singing, our voices topped out at the same note, E4/F4. At the end of every practice session, where I strained and struggled as a fledgling singer, this friend gave me nothing but encouragement.
    Then I started KTVA and learning how to use the voice. As I started growing in my vocal development and began singing comfortably in full voice up to High C, I was puzzled to find that instead of complimenting me as my voice grew stronger and higher, this "friend" started criticizing me and giving me backhanded compliments.
    It was the same with many of my other "friends," who never seemed to give me a compliment when I sang really well. For the longest time, I felt very insecure about singing, especially about belting in my upper range.
    Ironically, what gave me confidence was compliments from people when I actually did sing in public, but the funny thing was.....these people were always TOTAL STRANGERS and staggeringly, people who did not like me at all previously.

    What gave me my confidence back was this:
    I was at a film shoot talking to an actor from Australia who was telling me how picky he was about what singers he liked and the long list of qualities he wanted for a singer to be impressive.
    Seriously, he made it seem like a singer had to be Pavarotti or Robert Plant to meet his standards.During the break from shooting, I was singing a blues song with my friend and started belting /wailing in my upper range. The Australian guy heard me and said he was amazed by what a powerful voice I had and what a great singer I was. He told me my friend and I should start a band, not knowing that we already had a band and that my friend (a guitarist) never complimented my voice at all. Lol.

    What I have come to learn is that singing is a musical skill very unlike guitar or piano. It is intensely personal and when you sing well with passion, it can make people who know you very well uncomfortable, both with the fact that you have such passion and the act that you might overshadow them in a way that they never thought possible. This is ESPECIALLY true if these friends sing, if only in a limited capacity, because you singing well will make their jealousy go through the roof.
    When jamming and singing with my musician friends, I have learned that their way of saying I do a good job is when they say nothing and instead remark about how bad their playing/singing was.

    @Joyce, I am happy that your performance received the praise it did from those other people and I would totally disregard what your teacher said. He sounds like a jealous perfectionist who was having a bad day.

    @highmtn, you put it very well here: "It's just kind of strange how reserved some folks can be and how they can be very careful to NOT compliment you, lest ye begin to believe in yourself that yes, there IS Hope that you can sing and sing well... It's just kind of strange how reserved some folks can be and how they can be very careful to NOT compliment you, lest ye begin to believe in yourself that yes, there IS Hope that you can sing and sing well... It's just kind of strange how reserved some folks can be and how they can be very careful to NOT compliment you, lest ye begin to believe in yourself that yes, there IS Hope that you can sing and sing well..."
    I guess as singers, unlike other musicians, we have to create our own confidence and accept the fact most compliments will come from total strangers.....
  • I brought something like this up in another thread, I forget which, but it also fits this subject. Here's an screen-capture from Ken's newest video.

    image

    I could blur out their names... but I won't. Mostly because they posted in a public place and it represents very little danger to them. I don't hear anything out of key. NOTICE that based on their profile picture, Caleb and Will are musicians.

    It seems like at least one person commenting on ANY public performance will bring up that it is pitchy and/or out of tempo. I've heard it about every known singer, good and bad.
  • highmtnhighmtn Posts: 10,664Administrator, Moderator, Enrolled, Pro
    edited July 2015 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Which one of them is Joyce's singing teacher?  All four of them seem to be cut from the same type of cloth.
  • streeterstreeter Posts: 656Moderator, Pro
    Hahaha, I've seen some of the comments on Ken's Vids. Just laugh them off. I had to comment on the Gabriella Girl Fight Vid though. People just have no idea what it takes to put together a quality commercially polished product these days...Still no where near as Scathing as some of the comments regarding guys like Arnel Pineda and Kelly Hanson... Those guys cop so much hate on YouTube.
  • highmtnhighmtn Posts: 10,664Administrator, Moderator, Enrolled, Pro
    Haters gonna Hate...
  • @matt53,
    quote
    Then I started KTVA and learning how to use the voice. As I started growing in my vocal development and began singing comfortably in full voice up to High C, I was puzzled to find that instead of complimenting me as my voice grew stronger and higher, this "friend" started criticizing me and giving me backhanded compliments.Ironically, what gave me confidence was compliments from people when I actually did sing in public, but the funny thing was.....these people were always TOTAL STRANGERS and staggeringly, people who did not like me at all previously.
    ....."It's just kind of strange how reserved some folks can be and how they can be very careful to NOT compliment you, lest ye begin to believe in yourself that yes, there IS Hope that you can sing and sing well.. unquote
    EXACTLY!!! that was my experience and my feeling.

    Just to let you know of what happened next, I have now officially lost my confidence when I sing in front of him and the others, the song that I delivered yesterday at the lesson was a distaster. God I could have cried , of course I am also tired, but I hope nothing is wrong with my voice . I have decided to quit training with this guy and this bunch.

    The good news is that (my prayers have been heard!!) there is a new singing teacher that has just open his school,ironically just in front of the "grintch".
      This young man has participated in the show "the Voice" in Paris.

    I hope that my singing adventure is not over yet and that it still has something nice in store for me.


  • highmtnhighmtn Posts: 10,664Administrator, Moderator, Enrolled, Pro

    I think you may be right, indeed.  When one door closes, another door opens.

    The loss of confidence in front of your critic and his flock could be the end of a bad situation and the beginning of a much better one.  

    One thing that you may not read much about in vocal forums would be the kind of situation you just had.  Not that many singers want to broadcast to the world that they had a humilating experience, but we've all had them at one time or another.  Without those awful moments, we have little to give us a perspective on what is a terrible experience as opposed to a truly uplifting and magical moment.

    Obviously, if we can choose, we would all select to have no pain in life and only joyful bliss... but there are life-lessons to be learned.

    Your singing adventure is far from over.  Pick yourself up and dust yourself off.  Time to start a new chapter in your singing life!  A better chapter.  You get to help write how it comes to be.

    : ^)

    Expect the Best!

    Bob 


  • OK, so this is what sent in explaining my reason for wanting to join this site...it's long as hell, and states everything I think I'd like to convey, so I'm just copying and pasting it in efforts to save my poor thumb from anymore suffering.

    I've been singing all my life. This whole time I've also been on a constant journey to improve my voice. I have a natural ear for music that kind of defies what many people understand. I hear harmonies in my head even without music playing, and I can write melodies or incredibly odd harmonies in seconds without even thinking...when I write melodies I turn off my brain and somehow end up almost instantly coming up with 2 to 3 melodies to edit and splice. I can come up with parts for any instrument, save guitar, because my brain just can't figure out the underlying logic of guitar chords...I get chords on piano, but guitar just is weird...I like it this way though, because it forces me to need someone else to actually write a song, which I think is perfect. I also write pretty good lyrics as well, and I have a great sense for song structuring.

    Now that I've patted myself on the back with my now dislocated shoulder, my big reason for joining us to get feedback and maybe help some others too. I've worked very hard to recognize my own flaws, take ownership of them, and then do everything I can to either fix said flaw or maybe set it in a more proper and healthy context to maybe transform my perception of it being a flaw to begin with. The strongest people embrace their weaknesses and can thus craft those seemingly inferior traits into positives. I've been alone pretty much my whole life, so that's why I've worked so hard to achieve that mentality...I want to constantly grow as a human being, and facing yourself head on without shame or regret always seemed like the best way to do that to me. But anyways, I'd like some feedback or criticism. I want to grow more as a singer. But I really hate when someone blatantly and cavalierly seems to just be trying to shatter my confidence...like this one guy who (even though I told I'd been on stage and recorded in my lifetime) decided to ask me if I'd ever recorded my singing and listened to it, because, somehow, (which I still can't understand how) he said that every single note I sang was flat...I was improvising an r and b sort of melody for some music he wrote, and it was my very first attempt also. Not to mention that it was my first time doing anything in music in 5 years due to my band of like 8 years turning on me and kicking me out because I was "crazy"...I actually just ended up getting the girl my drummer apparently had a thing for, and my guitarist had been jealous of me since we formed the band...I know this because of all the weird comments he (and the rest of them occasionally as well) would make to me always diminishing my role in the music writing process...they also would demand I sing things I didn't feel comfortable singing, and they played so loud that I had to scream and ended up butchering my voice for a few years until I stopped. It was a terrible situation for me, both because of self made choices (I felt like I had to grind my voice in order to sound more powerful...the constant forced screaming ended up giving me constant sinus infections and it destroyed my accuracy...but those are back now praise god), and because of the people I was working with...it was my first real band though, and we did a lot of fun shows, and it is how I learned to be a great frontman...so when I got kicked out it devastated me...(plus my living situation sucked/sucks, and my life has not had any real joy in it...it's been filled with abuse, neglect, and too many bouts with suicide, plus one almost too close to successful suicide...so Yea...). Anyways, so that guy knew I was kinda fragile and was wanting some help getting back into the groove of things, and plus, I had sat for 3 hours listening to his music and telling him my thoughts on it, which was almost all positive. Yet, I'm given one attempt to write a unique melody to something I'd heard twice, and when I did, he completely trashes everything I did and then brings my music credibility into question by condescendingly asking if I had ever actually listened to my voice on a recording (which he knew I had because I brought it up at least 5 times...). After he told me ever single note I sang was flat and I thanked him for what I at first thought was genuine criticism, he started acting super weird. He suddenly had to go pick someone up or something, so he told me I needed to leave immediately...it's like me singing made him become super stand offish...I still don't quite get it. Anyways, that comment DEVASTATED me for months...I would spend hours singing into tuners and recording myself over a song playing, so I could see how flat I was. While these exercises have ended up helping me out...it turned out that every note I sing ISN'T flat...but I can't see why that guy would tell me it is...
  • highmtnhighmtn Posts: 10,664Administrator, Moderator, Enrolled, Pro
    Yes, and to save my thumbs and fingers from copying and pasting my response to your story, I defer to that version of the same story that you also posted in the "Introduce Yourself" area of the forum.

    And we want to welcome you.

    I do suggest that when you post (and everyone else, too) that we all post any given demo or wall of text, or whatever, only once in one place. When members post the same thing in more than one place, the discussion can get disjointed, sometimes people get ticked off because they think everybody is ignoring the poster, but instead they were answered in the other area, yada, yada... continuity is lost when several people respond to the post but in different places. It just works best to keep it all together.

    Enough from the Posting Police.

    Your story is worth telling, so I understand why you wanted to be heard. And yes, there are a lot of folks discussing the same kind of thing here that you posted about in the other area: Rude people doing rude things to people who don't deserve to be treated that way.

    So if I see a lot of people chiming in here, I'll just go delete the other thread so that we can keep things a little more coherent. I'm not trying to be rude, I'm just trying to help keep the flow more contiguous.

    :^)

    Bob


  • matt53matt53 Posts: 182Pro
    edited August 2016 Vote Up0Vote Down
    @BliviousO the unfortunate reality of the music world is that at any level, it attracts those who are seeking an escape from their problems and that means you will inevitably have to work with really nasty people like your guitarist. God knows I've had to deal with people like that.
    In my current band I work with a drummer who was always looking for some excuse to rip on my singing, especially my upper high range belting which he described as "high falsetto straining." HA!
    Then one day, a guest guitarist commented positively on my ability to sing Led Zeppelin and this outside approval weirdly not only seemed to silence my drummer's criticism but he also complimented me on my upper range.
    I can also relate to your frustration of screaming over your loud guitarist and band.
    When I started out with this band, I was oversinging like crazy because even with a PA system, I just couldn't hear myself.
    It wasn't until I started using in-ear monitors that I actually started singing better with this particular group.
    In the end, you aren't able and shouldn't have to fix the issues that people in your group have. Hone your singing skills and constantly improve but also try to find a band environment that doesn't include toxic people.
Sign In or Register to comment.