Thanks @ragnar! Yes, it was a one-take. I did two separate one-takes, only because I said a wrong word the first pass. It was the second recording that I kept.
It really is a deceptively hard song to sing!
I'll have to put more effort into the lower parts. Funny, I thought that was the part I did better on, but mostly because I don't have to work quite so hard on those parts... I'll work harder on it now... Thanks!
I watched a live version by Hozier, the Virgin radio one, which was pretty good, I was pretty impressed on that particular one he did, and really liked how the crowd joined in, and how humbled he seemed... it was great. For anyone who would like to see it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3fjPfTBA40
You mentioned that you were out of breath. That would be my remark, as well. It's a very wordy song, and that means lots of consonants. Those consonants break the song up a lot and hammer away. If you could find a way to sustain longer (yeah, I know, how?) it would help your delivery of the song. I listened to the Virgin Radio version, and I hear Hozier doing that, sustaining more and hammering less.
I think this would be one of those songs where you do Ken's method of practicing it without consonants, learning to get the most out of the vowels, and then go back to slightly de-emphasized consonants. That's a lot of work, but if you plan to keep doing the song it will be worth it. To your credit, you sing the G# in full voice, and Hozier, (doing it in the higher key) sings a weaker-sounding airy head voice A on that note.
Maybe after you're feeling better, you can find some more sustain for your notes and pull back on the peaky consonants. I can see why people like this song, especially in a live environment.
@Highmtn: Thanks Bob. I'll work on those things. This is all such good input from you and @ragnar. It helps a lot.
We are going to try to figure out a way to do this, but it'll be difficult to do it justice with only an acoustic guitar and drums, when our bass player is with us, that will be a bit easier, but missing those low beefy keyboard chords might take a lot away... I don't know, we have not tried it yet. I'm just learning to sing it so we can try it.
I think I need to get out walking or running again, to build up my lungs again... sigh...
So a couple of weeks in to Volume One, still focussing on stretching chest and thought I'd test myself applying it by singing through a song that is far too difficult for me (what an idiot!) This is a clean track, no studio magic. Just compression on the vocals. I've brought the band down so vocals are loud in the mix.
(new link as the one before was not working)
My issue is... I sound like a freaking screaming banshee! And not in a good way. Lzzy Hale obviously has amazing range and amazing grit and distortion which makes her version much more 'listenable'. I guess I'm no where near moving on to that in the programme yet so it's not a massive issue. I just wish I had better tone naturally!
Main thing I'd like to know. Am I singing in chest/mix/chesty mix? It kind of feels like I've dropped some of the weight when I go up to the higher notes but I'm finding it very hard to identify. Should I even bother trying to identify it?!
Any criticism or advice on how to improve would be fabulous, as always Don't turn it up too loud...
@Fenderjdi,
Track is private , please set to share.
Also use a keyboard if you can to help identify your range. It took me a while to understand and hear what my range is right now. I used a keyboard and my recording program shows me in a graphic so it helps.
As soon as you start to feel the break that is where your top of chest is. Record a L-AH track and share that as well.
@Fenderjdi,
Track is private , please set to share.
Also use a keyboard if you can to help identify your range. It took me a while to understand and hear what my range is right now. I used a keyboard and my recording program shows me in a graphic so it helps.
As soon as you start to feel the break that is where your top of chest is. Record a L-AH track and share that as well.
Thanks, @kaulfers I have edited the previous comment with the correct link! I agree, definitely need to dust off my keyboard and use it to keep an eye on my range! Rhea.
Yes, you are singing in chest, and when you go high, even with the weight that you drop it's more of a chesty mix.
What is making your version sound more harsh than Lzzy's:
Lzzy has probably been doing this a bit longer than you, belting in this range.
She is singing more open, less pinched for the high notes.
Lzzy is using a lot more support than you are, especially when going high. Your volume increases noticeably on the high notes, even though you used compression on the recording. When you get better at support, you will be singing this more from the gut. Now it's more from the throat, and you are really pushing to get to it. Eventually, after stretching your chest more, you will not have to push nearly as hard to get these notes. You will compress yourself. Your support will act as a shock absorber for your vocal cords so you won't hit them so hard with air to get to these high notes. You will keep your diaphragm in a state of resistance that will keep it from punching so hard on the high notes.
You will not be singing stress-free, but you will learn to manage that stress much more.
Your pitch is good on this tune, but your delivery is not smooth yet. That will come as you grow in range and power. You will learn to reserve part of your power. You will govern the power that you use, and you will be more confident in the notes, so there will be less tendency to overuse breath power. Also, support itself helps to beef up the tone. With the power coming from the diaphragmatic engine instead of trying to muscle it out of the throat, you use less air and get more tone.
This tune also has a lot of fast words, and as a result, a lot of consonants. Some of the smoothing that you will learn will come from sustaining vowels and minimizing consonants. But that will come later.
This is a tough song. As you gain more skills, songs like this will begin to become more reachable in a professional manner. Right now it's a bit like training for Mount Everest on Mount Everest.
I don't know why but it seems like it takes an eternity to build a good voice. I am really starting to like my voice but I guess the saying "You are your own worst critic" really comes into play because no matter how good your voice is, there's always room for improvement and no one ever has the perfect sounding voice.
Anyways! I decided to re-do a recording of a song a friend of mine wrote, just as practice to see where my voice is now after practicing with the vocal coaching lessons (and I'm still in Volume 1 after more than a year).
Yes. Hearing our own voice played back can make one cringe. The more you do it, though, the more you are able to focus on what you want to do to improve the sound and technique. It can take a long time to move forward. That is something that goes according to the individual, and how much time you spend on focused practice and exercise.
You're on pitch in this demo. You're using distortion, which I expect is intentional. Be careful with that, because you don't really learn to do that until you are well into Volume 3.
Sounds like you could use a little more support to help get a little more tone and stability. How long since you sent in a good old Lah exercise?
Now I gotta post my first Recording after 3 weeks in Volume 1, I was never able to sing that song a month ago, because I used to push too much air and too much volume, I still fight with these old bad habits, but it really gets better And I can sing nearly an A4 in actual songs, I was struggling with f4 2 months ago Except for EEE Vowels.... They hate me :P
Thank you very much Bob I slowly get the feeling of the open throat with my AH vowels, but somehow mostly only when i slept enough long like 7 hours or more... Well I think I still need to relax beside training^^
I will upload another song next week which I recorded with this one here last saturday.
Me singing two songs not took away the music so the voice can be heard clear. Find it interesting how different a voice sounds without arrangements or editing! Recorded with my phone
You are braver than I am. Doing musical theatre like this, without the cover of the orchestra takes guts!
Nice G#4 at 0:42 on What Have I Done! Good support, and great tone! The Bb4's sound like they need a little less weight and a little more support up that high. But what a pair of lungs you've got!
The high B4's on Always need a bit of modification to round out those "I" vowels. Those are very hard to pull off up that high without vowel modifications. The vowels will tend to splat. "I" for instance would be "Ah-ee", or "Aw-eh", depending on the note. That's also an area where we would need to pare down the weight and support more.
These are very good recordings for being done on a phone. I'd like to hear them with music backing tracks for reference. Sometimes "just voice" tracks are hard for the listener to be able to tell if pitch is right without a reference track.
On the intro you struggle to find the pitch. From about 0:57, where the verse begins, you are much closer to correct pitch more of the time. When the chorus comes back, you again are a ship without a rudder. You will have to build a rudder. We all need a working pitch rudder.
You have stated before that you struggle greatly with pitch and also with timing. This recording proves that you do have issues, but when you ARE on pitch, it's not bad at all.
You will need to do a lot of training on pitch-matching, and singing scales. You also need to learn support and build your voice, but you are not the hopeless case you seemed to say you were. You just need to train your ear and your brain to process what you hear, and match pitches better. It's a skill that is hard to learn, but it IS learnable. You are NOT medically tone-deaf. You have a lot of work to do, and it takes time, but you can become a much better singer than you presently are, if you are self-motivated and practice the right skills.
It won't be a walk in the park, but if you are persistent and willing to listen very carefully to the notes of the music and what is coming from your voice, and make corrections on the fly, you will persevere.
This is not an easy song. You have a long way to go to be able to pull this one off and do it well, but you CAN do it, if you are willing to do what it takes to improve your sense of pitch discernment and learn to find anchor notes to help pull you to the right pitches.
@highmtn hey its been awhile since I posted anything.. Still home from surgery a week and a half ago but here goes nothing.. Me singing Kryptonite at karaoke sorry first 40sec is dead air. But I knew he'd pick this song so I recorded it. Listen to Demo Kryptonite at Karaoke by Steven Kindig #np on #SoundCloud
Listen to Demo Kryptonite at Karaoke by Steven Kindig #np on #SoundCloud
@highmtn I've been sing this song for awhile for the most part. I felt comfortable thru out the song. Not really blowing a lot of air. I used to get tired out sininging this song but not hardley now. I feel I'm getting a lot brighter and have to hold back the extra sound/loudness I can make. The last "If I go crazy" verse I intentionally try doing it in a more open throated head voice sound. I haven't picked this song apart to much so im sure there's a lot of pitch issues. I'm really at this point trying to build up support. Singing songs in my range and the higher range songs slowly starting to sound better. I think tho my totally sound is still in need of a more richer sound. So besides more and more practice I am going to start up KTVA exercises again. I've put a back burner because I've specifically been working on support. Maybe I'm backward ATM but we go where we feel is right at the moment. I have yet to even start going into vol 2. I did a couple times but stay out of it. As I'm still a new singer.
Over here in China, it's the Spring Festival/Chinese New Year holiday (when I usually get more free time) and I found myself, this year, getting all caught up in local hysteria regarding a chubby, jolly fellow who has been spotted in the audience of CCTV (China Central Television) 's annual Gala New Year's broadcast. You can quickly read the story below to get some insight as well as what some local people think of it (translated to English)
So, I basically remember reading that article a few years back and decided to tune in to the show (lord knows what they're actually saying... ) only to see if "Fat Brother" would again make an appearance - which would make it 14 years running.
Low and behold, not even 30 minutes into the program, he was no doubt there donning a handsome yellow traditional frock.
It's moments like these, among others, which inspire me to write music. This is my first 'comedy' song - as far as I can remember...
I had some piano and string loops (in A, C, G, D) and thought I could whip those together and write some lyrics to match.
Below is what I ended up with. I'm thinking of putting a video together with several of "Fat Brothers" appearances from over the years which are archives online at various local sites. Hopefully the tune catches on. Who knows, maybe I'll get to meet the guy? haha
Good morning / day / night - whenever, wherever you are!
@SteveK - Thanks, man. 13 hits on Chinese social media so far. May have better luck finding a missing airliner before the identity of said brother... It was a cool trip to throw together nonetheless :-)
@highmtn - Thank you, too. I've been trying different treatments in the home studio to cut reflections down. So far, the budget set up is a bamboo room divider placed like a horseshoe around the mic, a 6x4 carpet under that and, practically, a mattress behind me against the wall. I think more refugees than musicians would feel comfortable with the decor, but it lends well to getting a dryer recording.
@SteveK - I just had a listen to your "Kryptonite" karaoke rendition - it's good and sounds like you're having a lot of fun singing it. I can't believe that it's been 15 years since that song was released??? OY.
And you know, that brought a flood of memories of 2000 back - Red Hot Chilipeppers, Papa Roach, Filter, Creed.
I think I'm gonna be on YouTube for a little while reminiscing (instead of focusing on the fact that it was 15 years ago! LOL)
@highmtn the for the compliment. My wife will surely be thrilled. My wife always talks about how she plays with her words to get different effects. My wife asked me to ask you to give her what you thought she needed to improve on? the only Ktva she has is what i have given her in the time i have had the program. She's starting to be able to pick up on my support issues. We learn alot from eachother. yes we sing a couple songs together. we have one in perticular we sing. " Just You And I".. Sharing our love together. Hey Bob I'm rdy for a revamp for improvement on kryptonite. Although I have improved a lot I need some direction to improve what I have so far... If you would pic a few things that would greatly improve my performance. Ty.....
@Johan_Kalevi ty for listening to kryptonite its my fun song. But alas I feel it has no soul in it I need to find it. Like the new song I'm trying out " I'm already there " by lonestar. I almost cry during it.
Was back at it in the studio today - I had tried yesterday, however it sounded like a war zone outside the building; something special related to the 5th day of the Chinese New Year and blowing up massive amounts of fireworks?
This track is an original composition called "Revealing"
I hope you enjoy it and if you have any comments or suggestions, feel free to share.
This is a track that I recorded on the 21st but delayed mixing and mastering it until today - it uses a drum machine beat from www.drumbot.com and I put my acoustic electric through the 'guitar suite' in Adobe Audition to get a crunchy electric sound.
@highmtn I got a chance to really listen to my Kryptonite recording. Although I have gotten stronger singing this song. I see where I was dropping off at the end of my phrases. I think my tone is getting better but I need to still get a more relaxed tone. Make the words flow more sustained during phases. I realize I just got out of a surgery and my strength will return but with what I presented to you. Is there anything you would do in addition to what was mentioned.
@highmtn the best way to accomplish this would be singing the the vowels only Ina smooth transition then slowly add the consonants in. Keeping the smooth flow of sound. So I've heard videos and posts. Lolthis forum is awesome...
Hey, I just noticed my 1 year anniversary at the KTVA Forum was this past week. I've just thrown confetti all around my living room... lol
Last day in the home studio today before heading back to work tomorrow after 8 days of holiday time. Where does the time go?
I've got one more original composition to contribute to this thread - it's a song I'd tried recording about 2 months ago.
With all the songs that I recorded this week, I've been able to notice where some of my improvements have been made (support, tone, vocal cord closure/cutting back air) and where I still need to make some improvements: stretching chest voice into the higher register, vowel modifications and still better support. Those are just off the top of my head.
One thing I certainly notice, after having been through the three volumes once, is that I have definitely transfered the bulk of the work to the diaphragm to power into higher notes and I do feel a lot less weary about tackling them in songs. I also notice that after a week of recording, my voice feels excellent and not stressed or scratchy. If I had done the same amount of songs before starting with KTVA, I would sound like a troll at the office tomorrow - and probably would have caught a cold because of vocal cord irritation and swelling. In a nutshell, I put high praises on Ken's vocal training, and it is something that I will constantly work at. I've 'been through' the volumes, but I've surely not 'completed' them. Sometimes going back to Vol I or II (as Bob had suggested and continues to suggest to others) is necessary to revise and strengthen certain aspects that we've become lazy with or not mindful of.
When I joined KTVA, I was still straining to hit high notes with unsafe distortion, and I was killing my voice when I did it. I'm realizing that to be ready for hyper glottal compression, I'm still going to need to be more patient, but while I wait, I can enjoy this new voice that I've trained.
This will be the last installment of contributions for a while - gotta work hard at paying the bills which tends to trump all other joys of life lol
It has been enjoyable hearing the changes and improvements in your voice. You have a nice, bright tone. Sounding quite clear and confident on A4's in chest voice. Writing nice tunes and enjoying yourself.
@highmtn OK Bob here's one you don't have to say much about. Just take a listen and tell me something good lol... I know my support needs lots of help I'm afraid to really push down cause my surgery. But a work in process none the less.....
Listen to Demo firdt try Say Something at Karaoke by Steven Kindig #np on #SoundCloud
Listen to Demo firdt try Say Something at Karaoke by Steven Kindig #np on #SoundCloud
Last night I received an email from one of the editors, Kai, at www.chinasmack.com - they would like to do a feature on the song and video for "Fat Brother" in an upcoming edition. That's pretty cool!
@highmtn - Wouldn't that be a real trip? I'd love it. I'd be clapping and laughing just as randomly coz I wouldn't understand a darned thing that was being said LOL
What do you think? Sky blue tuxedo with ruffles? :-)
Very nice. Sorry, I missed your post in the flurry of new posts here and hadn't heard it until you called my attention to it.
You have really improved. There are a few pitch inconsistencies, but really your progress is shockingly good. You are hitting notes that you would have totally missed, not even close, in the past. You have a high register that you are accessing without much effort at all.
You are right, it (especially the higher parts) could use a bit more support, but you ARE supporting and you don't need to rush that after your surgery. I think you've crossed over from the mystery and are beginning to move towards the mastery.
You have a lot of guts to get up and sing a hard song like that in front of people, and you did a good job. You could have had an EPIC FAIL, but you didn't, you pulled it off. You still have a ways to go, but I'm proud of you for the progress you are making. Keep the faith, and keep up the good work!
I'm sorry, pal, but you're just getting too good. I couldn't find anything to tell you to improve.
You did a great job on both of these songs. Your voice is smooth and soothing. You must be knocking them dead at the Karaoke clubs. I just sat back and enjoyed these two songs.
You seem to be moving to a place where your feeling for the song is able to transcend the mechanics of singing the song. That's what everybody wants. To sing with feeling or at least to make your audience believe you are, is the magic everybody wants.
Finally starting to feel decent again, after many weeks of scratchy, tight, icky throat... Was feeling like I had made some progress on the support over the past week or so, and did a few recordings... not great, but I think my tone is getting better. I don't think it's quite as "pinched" or "froggy" as before... maybe it's just me WANTing it to be that way... haha...
Three songs, "The Scientist", "Sugar" and a higher key of "Take Me To Church" (before, I lowered it a full step)... listen if you feel inclined and give me feedback. I know parts of "Sugar" are a bit weak (OK, maybe all of them)... for some reason I sing it better when not recording... ???
Your voice is improving, despite the temporary setback of your recent "icky throat" episode.
I can hear your voice beginning to get stronger, especially with the higher version of Take Me to Church.
You're beginning to get a start on your support. You really need to build it more. You will need to lean on that support most of the time. I believe you have made some progress on support, but I think you will realize when you manage to get some full-on support going that it is the missing puzzle piece to your voice that you are still on the verge of tackling.
Don't feel bad about where you are. You are quite close to nailing it. You will be liking your tone even more when you start leaning into support to a greater degree.
I spent many years wanting to sing this song but didn't have the range.Then came open throat singing...."Empty Chairs and Empty Tables" http://www.singsnap.com/karaoke/r/c5a0311fd. This second one is a tricky song to sing because of quick lyrics and the challenging tune in the bridge. "She"
Great job. I see you're getting lots of fan comments in your songs on Singsnap. That's cool.
These are very melodic tunes. You often pick tunes that are challenging and require great pitch discernment, and you handle them well.
I have two suggestions.
On Empty Chairs at Empty Tables:
The first you will recognize. On the extended (sustained) word "on", that spans two musical notes, and the same later on "floor", you use an audible "h" to launch the second note of the sustained word. So a long, two-note "on" becomes "Ah-Hon" and "floor" becomes "flo-Hor". These will sound more professional if you can lose the extra "h".
You can do this by being aware of the tendency in the first place, take a little extra breath to use to extend the AH vowel through both notes of the two-note extended ON, and similarly an extended ah, oo, or uh vowel in floor.
If you feel that you must "push off" the second note with an "h" then use a "silent h" or as Ken calls it, a "little h", but I would recommend instead not using a consonant at all, and simply extending the vowel that the note change takes place on. It's more musical that way, and keeps your Open Throat maintained throughout the word or syllable.
On "She" I heard a couple of plosives. The "P" on Private and also on Proud both popped noticeably. Are you using a nylon hoop pop filter? If not, that could help to minimize that. Foam sleeves can also help with that, but they can take away some desirable sounds also.
If you're using one or both of these items, you could just watch for the plosive consonants (B, P, D, T, etc...) and slightly turn your head or move back just a bit when they occur.
That's it. Otherwise, more great singing, getting better all the time.
Marissa and I cover Zedd's I Want You To Know! We also show off our dance moves and biceps. Thanks to one of my fans for suggesting this song, I really like it!
I like the dual vocals. The voices blend well. Good Tango. Each individual voice sounds pleasing, and the combination is very good, as well.
Your friend is a better tambourine soloist than you, however. I've always been a big fan of Elton John, so maybe that explains it.
This is a good song.
Bob
I'm glad you liked it Bob! I've been working on my interpretive dancing. I do have to agree that Elton did work that tambourine much better, that's something I'll have to work on.
Thanks Bob! Tooked some (hundred)hours to get those vocals sound how i wanted first demo was recorded in the beginning of October. Those days I could hit those notes but that was far away from singing, it was more like a chicken sound
In the past week, I just found out about a really interesting website: "Bandhub.us".
For those of you who are looking to practice your singing with other real musicians to collaborate with, it's a pretty cool way to do so.
The link I'm adding is a collaboration I've initiated "Alice in Chains - Nutshell". At the moment, I'm actually looking for anyone who'd like to add lead guitar parts; if that interests you?
Bandhub is free, and I think it could serve as a good tool to monitor vocal progress as well as having fun while doing it.
Yes, that has happened to me too. Sometimes it initializes the track controls quickly, other times, I've found that it hung.
I've had best results with Chrome, but I'm using Windows 7, so I don't know if that's an issue?
I'd say, keep with Chrome but try refreshing the page and clearing your history. That's how I got it to speed up and work more efficiently.
It may also depend on how many people are putting demands on their server. I'm guessing with all that's archived there, it could be quite a stress at times.
A funny side-point: when I use wi-fi and my android phone, it loads so much faster? But there's no track controls to play with...
@Johan_Kalevi: It appears that it might be either Windows 8.1 or the fact that I have an SSD hard drive in this computer... I have a Windows 7 notebook that works fine so far. I tried IE, and it won't work with most of the collaborations. It also is related to how many tracks are already recorded in the collab. I think my Win 8.1 can't load the controls properly into Chrome.
Hello, my name is Dawn. I have been using another vocal program for maybe 10 years now and although it helped me improve in the beginning, I quickly stopped progressing. I find myself blowing out my voice quickly at practice and gigs because I am trying to get a heavy rock sound and I dont know how. I have never liked my "girly" voice so I have been over-singing and distorting to compensate. After a few days of practicing KTV volume one, I re-recorded a song my husband and I have been developing for our band. I kept relaxed and controlled myself not to over-sing. I still sound girly, actually more so then usual, and I kinda like the change and my husband did too. I sang this song a dozen times practicing last night and using the few techniques I have learned so far, my voice wasnt fatigued at all. I am really impressed with the quick results and am looking forward to learning to be a better singer. To be honest, Gabriella is what sold me on this program. She sounds amazing. Trans-Siberian Orchestra! I have attached the recording that I did last night. I am so glad to have found this program and forum!
From the sound of what I'm hearing, you're not using a lot of weight or distortion in your voice, so it would make sense that you won't blow out your voice so quickly. I'd bet Bob or Ken will chime in here with more, better info, and also that in time, you can re-develop some distortion that won't kill your voice.
It's great that you are already finding a lot of differences in your voice after just a short time using KTVA methods. The other singing lessons didn't work after ten years. Just think what you'll sound like ten years from now!
Ken's methods just keep growing your voice the longer you practice his exercises and techniques. There is much more to come as your voice experiences changes over time. You will get better at preserving your voice and at building tone that you are really going to love.
I'm so glad I found KTVA after wasting years and tons of money on vocal methods that just robbed me. Ken's methods work! The others were practically useless.
Take your time and follow Ken's instructions exactly. Your voice will grow and grow. You're really just getting started.
@Johan_Kalevi: I just saw @blondiewales post, and went to read some of the posts by viewers... I love some of your replies to the idiotic, mean comments some of those people (trolls?) posted...
I would have been much harsher on my replies to some of these people. I really find it hard to believe how mean people can be posting crap to another person's posts when they don't even know a person or have any idea what they were doing. It seems to be getting worse and worse by the day/year. People hide behind their fake online personalities and tell others how to live their lives in such a horrible way lately.
I still think it's great, funny, interesting, and as one poster said "Haters gonna hate"...
Popular and not So popular (guilty pleasure) 80's Rock Compilation.
Almost exactly a year since I started Singing. Still Growing, Still Learning. Probably a happy medium of where I'm at. Not a bad vocal day but not a great one either. 20 minute warm-up. Sung Straight through. Treated it like a Live situation. NO second takes. Mistakes are there but when everyone is drunk who cares... Right??? Right??? Tried to replicate production of the originals though.
I've been with this program about half a year now and I'm loving it!! My learning process hasn't been daily or weekly at certain points of time due to my work and health but I've managed to really understand some things Ken is talking about in his lessons.
The most important thing I've learned so far, is how to stretch my chest voice. I used to hit the wall around F#4 with my chest voice and with my head voice it was around E5. And nowadays my wall with my chest voice is around C5 with a "clean voice". And my head voice goes up to D6. This is amazing
I've got my own problems with gastroesophageal reflux and fibromyalgia, which have their own affect on my voice. But still, I love music and singing It is my passion and it keeps me sane
Here's a duet I did with myself. The harmony part is a female part but I did it with a light head voice. "The song is "Say Something". whttp://www.singsnap.com/karaoke/r/b15fd6a43
Comments
Pretty good job, @rcrosier.
You mentioned that you were out of breath. That would be my remark, as well. It's a very wordy song, and that means lots of consonants. Those consonants break the song up a lot and hammer away. If you could find a way to sustain longer (yeah, I know, how?) it would help your delivery of the song. I listened to the Virgin Radio version, and I hear Hozier doing that, sustaining more and hammering less.
I think this would be one of those songs where you do Ken's method of practicing it without consonants, learning to get the most out of the vowels, and then go back to slightly de-emphasized consonants. That's a lot of work, but if you plan to keep doing the song it will be worth it. To your credit, you sing the G# in full voice, and Hozier, (doing it in the higher key) sings a weaker-sounding airy head voice A on that note.
Maybe after you're feeling better, you can find some more sustain for your notes and pull back on the peaky consonants. I can see why people like this song, especially in a live environment.
Bob
Nice song, @overdriveisclassy,
This is a very interesting piece. You're intensely into it. Nice melody, nice guitar work. Exciting that you're just about done with your album.
Good job on this original tune!
Bob
This is a clean track, no studio magic. Just compression on the vocals. I've brought the band down so vocals are loud in the mix.
(new link as the one before was not working)
Don't turn it up too loud...
Rhea.
@Fenderjedi,
Yes, you are singing in chest, and when you go high, even with the weight that you drop it's more of a chesty mix.
What is making your version sound more harsh than Lzzy's:
Lzzy has probably been doing this a bit longer than you, belting in this range.
She is singing more open, less pinched for the high notes.
Lzzy is using a lot more support than you are, especially when going high. Your volume increases noticeably on the high notes, even though you used compression on the recording. When you get better at support, you will be singing this more from the gut. Now it's more from the throat, and you are really pushing to get to it. Eventually, after stretching your chest more, you will not have to push nearly as hard to get these notes. You will compress yourself. Your support will act as a shock absorber for your vocal cords so you won't hit them so hard with air to get to these high notes. You will keep your diaphragm in a state of resistance that will keep it from punching so hard on the high notes.
You will not be singing stress-free, but you will learn to manage that stress much more.
Your pitch is good on this tune, but your delivery is not smooth yet. That will come as you grow in range and power. You will learn to reserve part of your power. You will govern the power that you use, and you will be more confident in the notes, so there will be less tendency to overuse breath power. Also, support itself helps to beef up the tone. With the power coming from the diaphragmatic engine instead of trying to muscle it out of the throat, you use less air and get more tone.
This tune also has a lot of fast words, and as a result, a lot of consonants. Some of the smoothing that you will learn will come from sustaining vowels and minimizing consonants. But that will come later.
This is a tough song. As you gain more skills, songs like this will begin to become more reachable in a professional manner. Right now it's a bit like training for Mount Everest on Mount Everest.
You're doing well.
Bob
@brad1983,
Yes. Hearing our own voice played back can make one cringe. The more you do it, though, the more you are able to focus on what you want to do to improve the sound and technique. It can take a long time to move forward. That is something that goes according to the individual, and how much time you spend on focused practice and exercise.
You're on pitch in this demo. You're using distortion, which I expect is intentional. Be careful with that, because you don't really learn to do that until you are well into Volume 3.
Sounds like you could use a little more support to help get a little more tone and stability. How long since you sent in a good old Lah exercise?
Good Singing to You!
Bob
Your voice is sounding good, @Dariolicious! Especially your AH vowels. Good tone. Keep working out. You're on your way!
Bob
I will upload another song next week which I recorded with this one here last saturday.
Still alot of work to do there
Have a nice Evening^^
Dariolicious
Find it interesting how different a voice sounds without arrangements or editing! Recorded with my phone
@vj
You are braver than I am. Doing musical theatre like this, without the cover of the orchestra takes guts!
Nice G#4 at 0:42 on What Have I Done! Good support, and great tone! The Bb4's sound like they need a little less weight and a little more support up that high. But what a pair of lungs you've got!
The high B4's on Always need a bit of modification to round out those "I" vowels. Those are very hard to pull off up that high without vowel modifications. The vowels will tend to splat. "I" for instance would be "Ah-ee", or "Aw-eh", depending on the note. That's also an area where we would need to pare down the weight and support more.
These are very good recordings for being done on a phone. I'd like to hear them with music backing tracks for reference. Sometimes "just voice" tracks are hard for the listener to be able to tell if pitch is right without a reference track.
Nice Job.
Bob
@overdriveisclassy,
Nice Rocker of an original.
Bob
Hello, @saliho44,
On the intro you struggle to find the pitch. From about 0:57, where the verse begins, you are much closer to correct pitch more of the time. When the chorus comes back, you again are a ship without a rudder. You will have to build a rudder. We all need a working pitch rudder.
You have stated before that you struggle greatly with pitch and also with timing. This recording proves that you do have issues, but when you ARE on pitch, it's not bad at all.
You will need to do a lot of training on pitch-matching, and singing scales. You also need to learn support and build your voice, but you are not the hopeless case you seemed to say you were. You just need to train your ear and your brain to process what you hear, and match pitches better. It's a skill that is hard to learn, but it IS learnable. You are NOT medically tone-deaf. You have a lot of work to do, and it takes time, but you can become a much better singer than you presently are, if you are self-motivated and practice the right skills.
It won't be a walk in the park, but if you are persistent and willing to listen very carefully to the notes of the music and what is coming from your voice, and make corrections on the fly, you will persevere.
This is not an easy song. You have a long way to go to be able to pull this one off and do it well, but you CAN do it, if you are willing to do what it takes to improve your sense of pitch discernment and learn to find anchor notes to help pull you to the right pitches.
All the Best!
Bob
Listen to Demo Kryptonite at Karaoke by Steven Kindig #np on #SoundCloud
Listen to Demo Kryptonite at Karaoke by Steven Kindig #np on #SoundCloud
You sounded pretty good Steve. How did you feel about it?
Your pitch was pretty good. Towards the end of the song you seemed to get more comfortable and warmed-up.
Not bad.
Bob
Anyway I appreciate the feedback
Ty
Steve
Over here in China, it's the Spring Festival/Chinese New Year holiday (when I usually get more free time) and I found myself, this year, getting all caught up in local hysteria regarding a chubby, jolly fellow who has been spotted in the audience of CCTV (China Central Television) 's annual Gala New Year's broadcast. You can quickly read the story below to get some insight as well as what some local people think of it (translated to English)
http://www.chinasmack.com/2011/pictures/cctv-chinese-new-year-gala-shill-since-2001.html
So, I basically remember reading that article a few years back and decided to tune in to the show (lord knows what they're actually saying...
Low and behold, not even 30 minutes into the program, he was no doubt there donning a handsome yellow traditional frock.
It's moments like these, among others, which inspire me to write music. This is my first 'comedy' song - as far as I can remember...
I had some piano and string loops (in A, C, G, D) and thought I could whip those together and write some lyrics to match.
Below is what I ended up with. I'm thinking of putting a video together with several of "Fat Brothers" appearances from over the years which are archives online at various local sites. Hopefully the tune catches on. Who knows, maybe I'll get to meet the guy? haha
Good morning / day / night - whenever, wherever you are!
Peace,
Johan
Listen to Demo help me hold on at Karaoke by Steven Kindig #np on #SoundCloud
Listen to Demo help me hold on at Karaoke by Steven Kindig #np on #SoundCloud
@Johan_Kalevi,
Great tune. Thanks for including the story so it makes perfect sense.
You're getting a lot better with your recording chops, as well. Nice job on the vocals.
Bob
@SteveK,
Your wife sounds right at home with the microphone. Do you two have any duets worked out together?
Bob
@highmtn - Thank you, too. I've been trying different treatments in the home studio to cut reflections down. So far, the budget set up is a bamboo room divider placed like a horseshoe around the mic, a 6x4 carpet under that and, practically, a mattress behind me against the wall. I think more refugees than musicians would feel comfortable with the decor, but it lends well to getting a dryer recording.
And you know, that brought a flood of memories of 2000 back - Red Hot Chilipeppers, Papa Roach, Filter, Creed.
I think I'm gonna be on YouTube for a little while reminiscing (instead of focusing on the fact that it was 15 years ago! LOL)
Peace
@Johan_Kalevi ty for listening to kryptonite its my fun song. But alas I feel it has no soul in it I need to find it. Like the new song I'm trying out " I'm already there " by lonestar. I almost cry during it.
Hmmm, you sing Kryptonite and feel it lacks soul, but you sing I'm Already There and are nearly in tears.
...there's a damn good chance you're Superman?
Be careful, there could be 3 people in black jumpsuits out to get you!
Peace :-)
@SteveK
Your wife can work on improving support, and a bit on pitch consistency. She does sound like a natural.
Bob
Spring holiday continues until Thursday for me - was again busy in the studio today.
Here's one of my favourites from Cat Stevens from the Catch Bull At Four album.
This one was a lot more challenging than I thought it would be.
Enjoy!
Was back at it in the studio today - I had tried yesterday, however it sounded like a war zone outside the building; something special related to the 5th day of the Chinese New Year and blowing up massive amounts of fireworks?
This track is an original composition called "Revealing"
I hope you enjoy it and if you have any comments or suggestions, feel free to share.
Peace
This is a track that I recorded on the 21st but delayed mixing and mastering it until today - it uses a drum machine beat from www.drumbot.com and I put my acoustic electric through the 'guitar suite' in Adobe Audition to get a crunchy electric sound.
It's an original song called "We Need Time".
Enjoy!
Ty for all your help
Steve
@johnKalevi
Nice tune, Revealing. Great sound, nice vocal textures and tones.
Cool sounds on We Need Time, too. You are getting a lot out of your recording rig, and it suits your abilities well.
Your originals are enjoyable.
Bob
@SteveK,
You hit the nail on the head. Sustaining the notes to the end. Supporting the notes to the end.
Tying the words together into a morecontiguous, continuous flow. Doing all of this in a very natural, musical way that feels right and sounds right.
You'll get it!
Bob
The
Steve
Thanks for having a listen, Bob. Thanks as well for your feedback and comments. That means a lot!
Peace,
Johan
Hey, I just noticed my 1 year anniversary at the KTVA Forum was this past week. I've just thrown confetti all around my living room... lol
Last day in the home studio today before heading back to work tomorrow after 8 days of holiday time. Where does the time go?
I've got one more original composition to contribute to this thread - it's a song I'd tried recording about 2 months ago.
With all the songs that I recorded this week, I've been able to notice where some of my improvements have been made (support, tone, vocal cord closure/cutting back air) and where I still need to make some improvements: stretching chest voice into the higher register, vowel modifications and still better support. Those are just off the top of my head.
One thing I certainly notice, after having been through the three volumes once, is that I have definitely transfered the bulk of the work to the diaphragm to power into higher notes and I do feel a lot less weary about tackling them in songs. I also notice that after a week of recording, my voice feels excellent and not stressed or scratchy. If I had done the same amount of songs before starting with KTVA, I would sound like a troll at the office tomorrow - and probably would have caught a cold because of vocal cord irritation and swelling. In a nutshell, I put high praises on Ken's vocal training, and it is something that I will constantly work at. I've 'been through' the volumes, but I've surely not 'completed' them. Sometimes going back to Vol I or II (as Bob had suggested and continues to suggest to others) is necessary to revise and strengthen certain aspects that we've become lazy with or not mindful of.
When I joined KTVA, I was still straining to hit high notes with unsafe distortion, and I was killing my voice when I did it. I'm realizing that to be ready for hyper glottal compression, I'm still going to need to be more patient, but while I wait, I can enjoy this new voice that I've trained.
This will be the last installment of contributions for a while - gotta work hard at paying the bills which tends to trump all other joys of life lol
Thank you for your audience...
Enjoy!
Peace
Nice additional tune, @Johan_Kalevi.
It has been enjoyable hearing the changes and improvements in your voice. You have a nice, bright tone. Sounding quite clear and confident on A4's in chest voice. Writing nice tunes and enjoying yourself.
Don't work TOO hard at paying the bills.
All the Best!
Bob
Thanks, Bob.
All the best to you, too!
Johan
Listen to Demo firdt try Say Something at Karaoke by Steven Kindig #np on #SoundCloud
Listen to Demo firdt try Say Something at Karaoke by Steven Kindig #np on #SoundCloud
Last night I received an email from one of the editors,
Kai, at www.chinasmack.com - they would like to do a feature on the
song and video for "Fat Brother" in an upcoming edition. That's pretty
cool!
Will share the link when they do!
Peace,
Johan
Good Luck.....
Steve
@Johan_Kalevi,
Maybe when your song goes viral, in the commemorative video, You will be in the studio audience, seated next to Fat Brother, singing the song to him!
; ^)
Bob
@highmtn - Wouldn't that be a real trip? I'd love it. I'd be clapping and laughing just as randomly coz I wouldn't understand a darned thing that was being said LOL
What do you think? Sky blue tuxedo with ruffles? :-)
@SteveK
Very nice. Sorry, I missed your post in the flurry of new posts here and hadn't heard it until you called my attention to it.
You have really improved. There are a few pitch inconsistencies, but really your progress is shockingly good. You are hitting notes that you would have totally missed, not even close, in the past. You have a high register that you are accessing without much effort at all.
You are right, it (especially the higher parts) could use a bit more support, but you ARE supporting and you don't need to rush that after your surgery. I think you've crossed over from the mystery and are beginning to move towards the mastery.
You have a lot of guts to get up and sing a hard song like that in front of people, and you did a good job. You could have had an EPIC FAIL, but you didn't, you pulled it off. You still have a ways to go, but I'm proud of you for the progress you are making. Keep the faith, and keep up the good work!
Bob
@Johan_Kalevi,
Yes. Sky Blue with Ruffles. Perfect.
; ^ )
Bob
@derrick,
I'm sorry, pal, but you're just getting too good. I couldn't find anything to tell you to improve.
You did a great job on both of these songs. Your voice is smooth and soothing. You must be knocking them dead at the Karaoke clubs. I just sat back and enjoyed these two songs.
You seem to be moving to a place where your feeling for the song is able to transcend the mechanics of singing the song. That's what everybody wants. To sing with feeling or at least to make your audience believe you are, is the magic everybody wants.
Good job. Keep 'em coming!
Bob
Hi Everyone,
Here's the link to the feature on chinaSmack's website.
http://www.chinasmack.com/2015/features/fat-brother-by-johan-pitkanen.html
One of the editors put the story together, but credited the post to me.
Doing well with over 92 views on Chinese social media.
Enjoy a read and a watch (YouTube link included in the article as well)
Peace,
Johan
Steve
@rcrosier,
Ray,
Your voice is improving, despite the temporary setback of your recent "icky throat" episode.
I can hear your voice beginning to get stronger, especially with the higher version of Take Me to Church.
You're beginning to get a start on your support. You really need to build it more. You will need to lean on that support most of the time. I believe you have made some progress on support, but I think you will realize when you manage to get some full-on support going that it is the missing puzzle piece to your voice that you are still on the verge of tackling.
Don't feel bad about where you are. You are quite close to nailing it. You will be liking your tone even more when you start leaning into support to a greater degree.
Keep at it, and keep recording.
All the Best.
Bob
@derrick,
Great job. I see you're getting lots of fan comments in your songs on Singsnap. That's cool.
These are very melodic tunes. You often pick tunes that are challenging and require great pitch discernment, and you handle them well.
I have two suggestions.
On Empty Chairs at Empty Tables:
The first you will recognize. On the extended (sustained) word "on", that spans two musical notes, and the same later on "floor", you use an audible "h" to launch the second note of the sustained word. So a long, two-note "on" becomes "Ah-Hon" and "floor" becomes "flo-Hor". These will sound more professional if you can lose the extra "h".
You can do this by being aware of the tendency in the first place, take a little extra breath to use to extend the AH vowel through both notes of the two-note extended ON, and similarly an extended ah, oo, or uh vowel in floor.
If you feel that you must "push off" the second note with an "h" then use a "silent h" or as Ken calls it, a "little h", but I would recommend instead not using a consonant at all, and simply extending the vowel that the note change takes place on. It's more musical that way, and keeps your Open Throat maintained throughout the word or syllable.
On "She" I heard a couple of plosives. The "P" on Private and also on Proud both popped noticeably. Are you using a nylon hoop pop filter? If not, that could help to minimize that. Foam sleeves can also help with that, but they can take away some desirable sounds also.
If you're using one or both of these items, you could just watch for the plosive consonants (B, P, D, T, etc...) and slightly turn your head or move back just a bit when they occur.
That's it. Otherwise, more great singing, getting better all the time.
All the Best.
Bob
Thanks for the reminder. I had completely forgotten about the push off using an "h". Very old habit I suspect. I'll have to watch out for it.
Hey, @overdriveisclassy,
Nice interpretive dancing!
I like the dual vocals. The voices blend well. Good Tango. Each individual voice sounds pleasing, and the combination is very good, as well.
Your friend is a better tambourine soloist than you, however. I've always been a big fan of Elton John, so maybe that explains it.
This is a good song.
Bob
Here is our new song.
Srofase - When Talking Is Over
- Esa
Sounding good, Esa! Awesome band, vocals sounding good!
Bob
-Esa
@derryckt,
I had to Smi (h) ile when I read your post, even before I listened : ^)
Good job on both of these. You're building a good consistency to your voice.
Bob
In the past week, I just found out about a really interesting website: "Bandhub.us".
For those of you who are looking to practice your singing with other real musicians to collaborate with, it's a pretty cool way to do so.
The link I'm adding is a collaboration I've initiated "Alice in Chains - Nutshell". At the moment, I'm actually looking for anyone who'd like to add lead guitar parts; if that interests you?
Bandhub is free, and I think it could serve as a good tool to monitor vocal progress as well as having fun while doing it.
Give 'er a try!
Hope to meet some of you there!
Peace
(P.S - It's recommended to use Google Chrome)
http://bandhub.us/s/54feff25060ec7c74da1b284
Yes, that has happened to me too. Sometimes it initializes the track controls quickly, other times, I've found that it hung.
I've had best results with Chrome, but I'm using Windows 7, so I don't know if that's an issue?
I'd say, keep with Chrome but try refreshing the page and clearing your history. That's how I got it to speed up and work more efficiently.
It may also depend on how many people are putting demands on their server. I'm guessing with all that's archived there, it could be quite a stress at times.
A funny side-point: when I use wi-fi and my android phone, it loads so much faster?
Good luck!
Peace
another vocal program for maybe 10 years now and although it helped me
improve in the beginning, I quickly stopped progressing. I find myself
blowing out my voice quickly at practice and gigs because I am trying to
get a heavy rock sound and I dont know how. I have never liked my
"girly" voice so I have been over-singing and distorting to compensate.
After a few days of practicing KTV volume one, I re-recorded a song my
husband and I have been developing for our band. I kept relaxed and
controlled myself not to over-sing. I still sound girly, actually more
so then usual, and I kinda like the change and my husband did too. I
sang this song a dozen times practicing last night and using the few
techniques I have learned so far, my voice wasnt fatigued at all. I am
really impressed with the quick results and am looking forward to
learning to be a better singer. To be honest, Gabriella is what sold me
on this program. She sounds amazing. Trans-Siberian Orchestra! I have
attached the recording that I did last night. I am so glad to have
found this program and forum!
https://soundcloud.com/madmen4/cruel-to-me-reference-track
Hi, @metaphysica.
It's great that you are already finding a lot of differences in your voice after just a short time using KTVA methods. The other singing lessons didn't work after ten years. Just think what you'll sound like ten years from now!
Ken's methods just keep growing your voice the longer you practice his exercises and techniques. There is much more to come as your voice experiences changes over time. You will get better at preserving your voice and at building tone that you are really going to love.
I'm so glad I found KTVA after wasting years and tons of money on vocal methods that just robbed me. Ken's methods work! The others were practically useless.
Take your time and follow Ken's instructions exactly. Your voice will grow and grow. You're really just getting started.
We're glad you found KTVA (and the forum), too!
Bob
Almost exactly a year since I started Singing. Still Growing, Still Learning. Probably a happy medium of where I'm at. Not a bad vocal day but not a great one either. 20 minute warm-up. Sung Straight through. Treated it like a Live situation. NO second takes. Mistakes are there but when everyone is drunk who cares... Right??? Right??? Tried to replicate production of the originals though.
Thanks dude.
We got to see Shakey Graves in concert in DC recently and decided to cover this track! Thanks to Marissa for joining me!
@overdriveisclassy,
Good rendition of a good song, and good singing partner...
I hear that you are bringing in some higher overtones in your voice now and dropping off some of the baritone weight. I've got my ears on you.
Sounding good, bro.
Bob
I've been with this program about half a year now and I'm loving it!! My
learning process hasn't been daily or weekly at certain points of time
due to my work and health but I've managed to really understand some
things Ken is talking about in his lessons.
The most important
thing I've learned so far, is how to stretch my chest voice. I used to
hit the wall around F#4 with my chest voice and with my head voice it
was around E5. And nowadays my wall with my chest voice is around C5
with a "clean voice". And my head voice goes up to D6. This is amazing
I've
got my own problems with gastroesophageal reflux and fibromyalgia,
which have their own affect on my voice. But still, I love music and
singing
Please take a look, here are my band's new tracks, we've got our own rock thing going on..
These are cool tracks, @hanne.k
The band rocks and so does your voice. It's well-recorded and sounding good.
Thanks for sharing your progress with us. It's great to see that you are doing well!
Bob